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wolfman1360
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Dual Opteron 6128, Dual Xeon E5-2670, both, or neither?

So I have the chance to get both of these from a colleague at work for basically pennies. In 2020, is it worth it?
I'm 100% new to running dual processors so is there anything I need to keep in mind?
I think with this project the only thing that will be an issue is MIP - I believe it needs 4 MB of l3 cache per core, so I could probably run 4-5 each on a single Xeon and 3 on the AMD?
How would I go about separating each processor so the project wouldn't run 12 MIP WUs on a single processor, or is this possible in Boinc? I believe these 6128's came in both 4 and 8 core variants - these are the 8 core, so 16 in total.
Again, completely new to this. I'm still debating if it's worth it at this point. Bring on the electric bill - and 2 gigantic space heaters in Canada. :)
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Crunching for the betterment of human kind and the canines who will always be our best friends.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by wolfman1360 at Jan 3, 2020 8:32:17 PM]
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Sgt.Joe
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Re: Dual Opteron 6128, Dual Xeon E5-2670, both, or neither?

In my opinion, the E5-2670 is the better bet. These are 8 core 16 thread processors introduced in 2012. So with this machine you would have 32 threads running. With the Opteron you would only have 16 8nits running at a time. the Opteron was introduced in 2010 so it is a couple of years older than the XEON. See this.
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Coleslaw
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Re: Dual Opteron 6128, Dual Xeon E5-2670, both, or neither?

The Xeon IMHO is the better deal of the two hands down. However, if you want to get both, Opterons (G34's) are still nice to run here if you can afford the electricity. The AMD chips had poor design for things like AVX and thus the Intel's blow their doors off when apps can fully utilize those optimizations. WCG doesn't usually have optimized versions of the apps, so don't normally come into play here much.
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wolfman1360
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Re: Dual Opteron 6128, Dual Xeon E5-2670, both, or neither?

The Xeon IMHO is the better deal of the two hands down. However, if you want to get both, Opterons (G34's) are still nice to run here if you can afford the electricity. The AMD chips had poor design for things like AVX and thus the Intel's blow their doors off when apps can fully utilize those optimizations. WCG doesn't usually have optimized versions of the apps, so don't normally come into play here much.

If I'm thinking rightly, the Opteron is similar to a Phenom 2 just with lower clock speed. It would still add 16 threads and would primarily be run here anyway. I'm sure things like MCM workunits would take 6 plus hours to complete if not longer, though.
I don't think there are too many projects that support avx, at least that I run, but it will be nice to have regardless, and the Xeon will probably complete those same MCM wus at least 25-30% quicker with twice the throughput with 32 threads.

Out of curiosity, how much power will both of these tend to draw - I'm assuming well over 350w for the Opteron and maybe 220-250 for the Xeon?

Really at this point I guess it just comes down to how much power and noise I want to make. The Xeon is a definite. AMD remains to be seen.
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Coleslaw
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Re: Dual Opteron 6128, Dual Xeon E5-2670, both, or neither?

CPU's only... http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/K10/AMD-Opteron...20(OS6128WKT8EGOWOF).html

http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Xeon/Intel-Xeon%20E5-2670.html

80-115 Watts each chip. Then the RAM you use, HDD, etc...

The good news is that G34 CPU's are really cheap. Check the board he has and see if you can put some better chips in it. I have a couple of 6274's in my G34 2P which are 16 cores each. It has been turned off for a few months as I need a new PSU for it. Some of the 12 core Magny-cores are usually 12 core chips but many find them to overclock better. So, depending on setup and project.... If you aren't going to overclock, then I would look for some cheap 16 core chips if your board supports them. The good news is that you can also use non-ECC DDR3 with most G34 setups.

Now, if you were a member of team HardOCP, I possibly could have access to a few http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/K10/AMD-Opteron...20(OS6172WKTCEGOWOF).html but doubt he would want to ship outside USA due to the cost of shipping....
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Coleslaw at Jan 4, 2020 1:22:42 AM]
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wolfman1360
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Re: Dual Opteron 6128, Dual Xeon E5-2670, both, or neither?

CPU's only... http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/K10/AMD-Opteron...20(OS6128WKT8EGOWOF).html

http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Xeon/Intel-Xeon%20E5-2670.html

80-115 Watts each chip. Then the RAM you use, HDD, etc...

The good news is that G34 CPU's are really cheap. Check the board he has and see if you can put some better chips in it. I have a couple of 6274's in my G34 2P which are 16 cores each. It has been turned off for a few months as I need a new PSU for it. Some of the 12 core Magny-cores are usually 12 core chips but many find them to overclock better. So, depending on setup and project.... If you aren't going to overclock, then I would look for some cheap 16 core chips if your board supports them. The good news is that you can also use non-ECC DDR3 with most G34 setups.

Now, if you were a member of team HardOCP, I possibly could have access to a few http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/K10/AMD-Opteron...20(OS6172WKTCEGOWOF).html but doubt he would want to ship outside USA due to the cost of shipping....

Of course, now that I get talking more with him, I get even more temptation thrown my way.
He has a few different cpus and boards he's trying to get rid of, as well as just cpus on their own. Apparently nobody around here wants these anymore.
Both of these, a Nehalem dual Xeon, 5520, as well as a Xeon E5-2620 that just seems like the 2670 with less cores and clock speed from what I can tell.
Higher clock speeds and lower power draw is tempting with the 5520. Essentially 48 more threads and I'll be paying less for both of these than the new Ryzen I was eyeing...The 5520 does need a board though but I do have some 600 w psus and ram available. Do I need ECC ram for either of these? I wasn't planning on using any.
Pretty excited to get these put together, whatever these end up being.
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Coleslaw
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Re: Dual Opteron 6128, Dual Xeon E5-2670, both, or neither?

You will have to look at the motherboards specs to find out if ECC is required. AMD is typically less restrictive in that area.

The e5520's are only quad core with 8 threads. Those use socket 1366 which is older (first iSeries chips) than the previously mentioned 2670's which were socket 2011. Socket 2011 motherboards have held their value quite well. A lot of the 1366 stuff only had ready boost on one of its cores whereas everything after I believe was all cores. I could be wrong on that. I would not waste much money on anything older than the socket 2011 stuff.

The e5-2620 is a hex core with 12 threads. It would certainly put out more PPD than the e5520 and would be a socket 2011 chip as well.

My advice would be to go with the socket 2011 stuff before the 1366 stuff if you are thinking just WCG as the more cores/threads will more than likely give you better output than the higher clock speed with lower threads. I don't know what kind of pricing he is giving you but definitely compare rates on eBay (that are actually being sold and not what is being asked). With tech that old, I would stick to dual or quad socket setups. Otherwise you are probably wasting a lot of money. The appeal to these older setups is that DDR3 RAM is really cheap compared to DDR4. DDR4 probably won't gain you much anywhere but the Math BOINC projects. Ryzens are great chips, but hard to justify the up front costs when there is so much decent hardware from previous generations being wholesaled by corporations cycling out their equipment.
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wolfman1360
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Re: Dual Opteron 6128, Dual Xeon E5-2670, both, or neither?

You will have to look at the motherboards specs to find out if ECC is required. AMD is typically less restrictive in that area.

The e5520's are only quad core with 8 threads. Those use socket 1366 which is older (first iSeries chips) than the previously mentioned 2670's which were socket 2011. Socket 2011 motherboards have held their value quite well. A lot of the 1366 stuff only had ready boost on one of its cores whereas everything after I believe was all cores. I could be wrong on that. I would not waste much money on anything older than the socket 2011 stuff.

The e5-2620 is a hex core with 12 threads. It would certainly put out more PPD than the e5520 and would be a socket 2011 chip as well.

My advice would be to go with the socket 2011 stuff before the 1366 stuff if you are thinking just WCG as the more cores/threads will more than likely give you better output than the higher clock speed with lower threads. I don't know what kind of pricing he is giving you but definitely compare rates on eBay (that are actually being sold and not what is being asked). With tech that old, I would stick to dual or quad socket setups. Otherwise you are probably wasting a lot of money. The appeal to these older setups is that DDR3 RAM is really cheap compared to DDR4. DDR4 probably won't gain you much anywhere but the Math BOINC projects. Ryzens are great chips, but hard to justify the up front costs when there is so much decent hardware from previous generations being wholesaled by corporations cycling out their equipment.

I know 2011 is newer and a lot faster, but Dual e5520 and 2670 for less than 3 cases of beer, everything included. I can't really argue with that. Less than a dollar a thread there. Start with this - I can always grab the single 2620 (I thought it was dual) later, but I do need a board for that, and cooler too.

How does Boinc see dual socket setups? Will it just show up as 16 or 32 cores? Essentially I'd like to run CPDN on cores rather than threads, but would running 16 concurrent run it on the cores of the two processors, or one processor with hyperthreading? This is all new to me so I hope I'm not asking a completely obvious question.
I hope that makes sense. Right now, CPDN is using 50% of my processors and WCG is using the rest, at least according to the app config.

Really looking forward to this. I know it's older hardware, but 48 threads is 48 threads, and I'd be spending $3000 plus for an equal amount of them with new Ryzen's (we won't talk about Intel). Yes, they'd be tons faster, but I just am not in a financial decision to spend that kind of money.
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Sgt.Joe
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Re: Dual Opteron 6128, Dual Xeon E5-2670, both, or neither?

With tech that old, I would stick to dual or quad socket setups

I agree with Coleslaw. I run 3 dual socket systems with 1366 sockets with hex core cpus. They do use quite a bit of electricity compared with the newer 2011 socket machines. Any new generations will subsequently be more efficient.The saving grace for me is I got the systems dirt cheap, $50.00 apiece.
One thing to beware of if you are interested in any quad socket or above machines is to check their total power draw at the wall under load so you put them on an appropriately sized circuit. I passed on a quad socket machine for that very reason.
Cheers
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wolfman1360
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Re: Dual Opteron 6128, Dual Xeon E5-2670, both, or neither?

With tech that old, I would stick to dual or quad socket setups

I agree with Coleslaw. I run 3 dual socket systems with 1366 sockets with hex core cpus. They do use quite a bit of electricity compared with the newer 2011 socket machines. Any new generations will subsequently be more efficient.The saving grace for me is I got the systems dirt cheap, $50.00 apiece.
One thing to beware of if you are interested in any quad socket or above machines is to check their total power draw at the wall under load so you put them on an appropriately sized circuit. I passed on a quad socket machine for that very reason.
Cheers

Both of these are being put on a 20 amp, so theoretically should be fine.
Out of curiosity, what should I be looking at for PPD of both of these? Believe it or not they were $40 together and that's in Canadian too, eh. ;) increasing my thread count by about 50% on their own.
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